avete

No sir Durandus you were not mistaken. I believe you opinion, and skills could be of great service. Especially in your very well displayed mastery of words.

Might I suggest you may have been talking over quite a few heads, and maybe some people were taken back by that, and did not know how to take it. Not that there is anything wrong with it. I would love your opinion here, and it looks like you have much experience in many things.

Could you maybe ease up on the word smithing so a thesaurus is not required for less skill chaps? Don't get me wrong I see the skill, and respect it. I am just seeking to take some of the ambiguity out of some of it in the name of transparency, and better understanding. If you could indulge me please? Thank you for your input, and all opinions matter here in my book.

avete

Yes that is better. Thank you for holding back some. I have much catching up to do here, but I wanna comb through some of your post. May take a minute. It is interesting to say the least, your skills are vast.

avete

I can't access your website is it real?

avete

I still have not caught up on reading that long post. I like everyone has had much going on, but I tell ya. I kinda like you already from originality alone. Even if I don't always know what the hell your talking about. :) Just kidding, your education of the philosophy of language is impressive. When I catch up don't expect it back is all, but I will do what I can.

LOL the way he speaks reminds me very much of the character V from Vendetta :)

The way I speak is a reflection of the momentum of my ideas...now, if you wish to have a beer with me over the counter of the local tavern, you would find that I have as rough and tumble a manner as any Sailor, Millwright or Engineer when away from these matters at hand here...but I'm glad that you find it amusing! How about a comment on the substance of the Thought though, as I can laugh at myself just as well without advertising to others that I am amused by their intellectual manner and disposition. Frankly, your comment here is base, fit for a chatroom, and not of a kind one would expect from a serious participant in the development of Occupy Encampments; perhaps even so of one who does not have anything to ad?

Hey, I was kidding. It was meant to be funny but I also said your education of the philosophy of language is impressive. I meant that and you are an original I meant that too big guy. Your are just deep, and require some pause and attention. At least for me that is.

Te nada...just working on my property and taking time away from Mpls to get some things done, such as landlords do occasionally. I wonder about all the chanting about jobs, jobs, jobs...which the elite intend to create, but first the need for a very large pool of available labor to keep costs down. What we need are not more jobs but a Cooperation among those who have been already rooked by the system...places of refuge and pooled resources/talent among Occupiers to answer our own needs...we need to opt-out of the system and rely upon each other...such as barter may perform...and landowners who share the Cause in order to make place for Encampment, first, and also supplies to support Encampments elsewhere accross the Nation and World...founded on Public Lands in absence of Private Benefactors and portable where necessary. Non-cooperation should be the theme, so far as the system goes...absolute and uncompromising till the Towers of the Beast (Corporate Hegemony) be undermined and toppled. Just my thoughts of today as I labor away on my Property in Dassel. Adieu.

Actually that theme and idea has quite a bit of popularity. It's just getting enough will and people to go along with it, or even the uncompromising with the beast. What is the best path there is what I am often asking. What do you think ?

There are, of course, many forms of non-cooperation...first and perhaps foremost, refusing to buy the junk products which Corporations produce by exploiting foreign labor, as well as Corporate Farming products...boycotting Holiday spending altogether throughout the year, targeting Corporations through a kind of Consumers' Union under a theme of "Buy American" or any such other locale...Occupiers worldwide can insist that products bought must be produced locally. The key here is to withdraw (non-cooperation) support for Corporations that exploit Humanity...Simplify our lives, turn off the Commercial Machine at home, do not participate in the "buying and spending, laying waste all our powers"...and turning to the Model of Cooperation among ourselves and away from the Competitive Model of the unholy trinity and psychopathic machine called Consumerism, Commercialism and Materialism. We, WE have become our own worst enemy by making ourselves vulnerable to a value system that must doom us to dependancy upon this machine...which cares nothing for our welfare, nothing for quality products of any kind, and is perfectly happy to let us starve, to kick us out of our homes (having been made whole by Us through our government bailouts of their machinations and manipulations of the mortgage security market), to threaten us with dismissal from our Labor-I have been fired from jobs for being a minute late to work, which isn't about any kind of loss to the company, but about Control, Intimidation, and Punishment for not being quite deferential enough...you see, they don't just want our Labor and our Wealth...they want our Souls...to be submissive, cowardly, greedy, anxious, and at each others' throats with jealousy and resentment.

On the other side of this equation...the equation of how People can or must relate, given the state of Our state...stands the Model of Cooperation, which is the ONLY, ONLY Model that will work to withstand, resist, and endure long enough to demonstrate the workability, indeed the Natural Order the World, of Life, and of Humanity...it is the Model of the Coop, and of the Commune, and of the Union...and requires a Center of Gravity...call it: Care for the ecology of Man.

We should also realize that Government and Corporations have consciously, intensively, purposefully contrived to work together in order to divide the People everywhere...to set us against each other, and to set-up Idols of Worship that do, and must, divide Us...such as Celebrity of every kind, normally attatched to Wealth as the symbol of success after which we all must drool with jealousy or envy, feeding or nurturing the collective consciousness in such a way as to ensconce Material Values as THE apex and definition of Success and Personal Worth...Sports and Entertainment chiefly...for which reason WE must withdraw from these as well, spending nothing on anything which promotes these Tools of Corruption...another form of Consumerism.

We should identify our local producers and support them...our local businesses of every stripe, run by our own kind...and support them...and make every effort to identify Others, like ourselves (no free rides for those whose object is to exploit our Generosity) who are willing to work with us in mutual dependancy...the Commune Model of Cooperation.

As an example...there are many who have lost their homes and others who are near to losing their homes...Why? Besides all other evident facts behind their loss there stands a value system that insists we all stand alone, helpless if helpless to ourselves...this is the Competitive Model. Why are you living alone, or in only the company of YOURS, which the Banks intend to rob you of? Why are you not opening your home to others, who are just as virtuous, kind, honest as yourself who can help you keep your stake of privacy? Because you are afraid a stranger might steal your stuff? Get rid of your stuff...give some away, sell what you can, try keep your few treasures...simplify. Or is it because you must be the BOSS and nobody whom you may invite to live with you and share the expence of a home would tolerate your domineering insistance to set the rules?

Everyone who has been corrupted by the State will model the State in their behavior...which means they will be domineering, abusive to others making mockery of those who differ from them in some inconsequential way, obsessed with their own importance, and anxious about their care, suspicious of strangers and uncompromising about what they expect to gain...always some profit....Well, the news is that both the government and the corporation intend to take everything from you anyway, including, and perhaps chiefly, your Dignity and every other support which the Humane and the Generous Model is capable of rescuing from loss. Never has it been more true that "United We stand, Divided We fall."

Finally, if We had an Encampment Protocol, We could sell the Commune more effectively as, at least, a temporary answer to the vast needs which are fast engulfing the People...which Protocol is just a Policy of Responsibility toward each other writ large, answering to all the needs which our Condition sponsors, and which would provide for a way for the People to learn a new value system, one closer to the Family model without the BOSS in charge but Concensus for the Camp; according to Our needs, not some argueable policy or dumb, parliamentary proceedure such as GA meetings I've seen revolve around...and hand gestures? My gods...I need permission to speak from a self-appointed facilitator and can't simply rely upon my good sense of the appropriateness of my thought to the tasks at hand?

The People have been too effectively molded to the present, Competitive model that reigns among governments and between corporations. If circumstances crush them and they become desperate, perhaps they will change their orientation and accept the fact that We have always survived by Cooperation, from the beginning, not through Competition...the Darwinian, predatorial model is wrong on the facts, wrong on the dynamic, and wrong on the conclusions about how our Society is founded and maintained...what We see today is a result of the assumptions gone along with this Model...and it need not be a "dog eat dog world", unless you are a psychopath...and the government would like that just fine, to create a society of psychopaths...all the easier to Control, really...nothing is so predictable as someone who will always, always, always act in their own material, soul-less self-interest...such as...Corporations.

Come out from among them and B ye separate! Rid yourself of the filth of this unholy system that seeks to enslave Humanity and the Globe, both in your own soul and in everything that touches your life...kill the Beast within first and you will know better how to slay the Dragon it serves...for make no mistake, IT seeks to own you completely...and every device of socialization is geared to turn you into a little dragon, grasping, consuming, complaining, insulting, mocking...jealous, greedy, self-important, unforgiving, intolerant, rensentful, vengeful, accusative and heartless...behold: your Government, captured by the Corporation. They will destroy U, by hook or crook, and lure you into some compromise or false promise to abandon your Plan for withdrawal...you are their Food...don't feed the Dragon!

Perhaps it would make sense for me to ad how I have answered a good number of these challenges and met them for the kind of Cooperation I advocate for, as follows.

I bought a home some years ago and set about to make it as self-sustaining as possible...built a 600 sq.ft raised garden and aquaduct to capture 750 gallons of rain and runoff, installing also a pool before the cistern to capture detritis, planting pond lillies and cat tails, which also supports an ecological niche of life. The home is small...1350 sq.ft...but I have two entrances, so I created two apartments, plus space in the basement for sleeping and some storage with a half-bath.

Then I opened my doors to a former Prisoner who, being a good guy that made some relatively harmless mistakes (out of misbegotten self-interests), and charged him rent under market price...that was five years ago, and he still rents a corner of the house with private entrance, his own refrigerator, and shared use of bathroom and kitchen. I moved to Mpls last year and rented my own bedroom to another...a woman, with a son...recently divorced and on SSI whose trailor was condemned and had become homeless, desperate, and nearly broken with desperation. She, too, pays less than market rates for rent; while I pay for the utilities, even though I don't live there any longer. Now, I have moved my own mother into the home as the ostensive "new owner," so far as the two others are concerned. She will sleep in the basement but have run of the house, use thereof, just as the others except for some private space each has...sharing kitchen, bath, and living room. They are all of a kind in terms of need and sentiments, placed together under pressure of similar suffering...so they sympathize with each other, find companionship in pain and hope, and cooperate from the heart to support the general welfare through shared contributions and good-will...each has found a safe haven, away from the prying eyes of government intrusion and the Rules of authoritarian dictatorialism...government policy....and each is on a very limited, fixed-income...but they are blissfully happy to be "off the grid," so to speak...though I provide cable and internet as a valueble information resources.

Today, I don't pay a red cent to maintain the property...(nor do I pocket a red cent, either), they utilize the garden for their own health and hobby...love my cats, almost to a fault (over-feeding them a bit), and are ready to work together for further support...I have invented an at-home hobby that they can perform for extra cash, the product of which I can sell, to their benefit for about 200 dollars a month to each...a nice sum, increasing their monthly by halving their monthly rent expence...again, not pocketing a red cent to myself...though the Pleasure I derive from being at least a rescue and refuge for three cast-off souls from the System is worth a small Fortune in Humane sentiments, friendship, generosity, and gratitude...and I'm just a guy who has never made more than 35K a year. This is a Model of Cooperation...and if one such guy like myself can perform as much in answer to the cruelty and brutality of the System, there is no reason that it cannot be replicated everywhere till We all stand apart and thumb our noses at the Dragon and it starve itself to death.

I could provide more...shelter for a handful of Occupiers on the Property...hot water and bath when needed, and even work at the local food processing plant till they are able to up-grade their living conditions, should they like...but this opportunity would require them to demonstrate a course of Right Direction, discoverable in their Voice and Enunciations, through which I could discern their determination for Change in the Spirit of our Age...I'm not really interested in rescuing anyone who is too given-over to their base appetites or scoundrel ambitions...they must cherish Life alone and know how to relish the moment where free of anxious anticipations of tomorrow.

...for behold the flowers of the field, how they adorn themselves...or the sparrow, how it is provided for...how much more of value are U than these?...have no care, therefore, of tomorrow...as what a Man needs is very near, and to those that ask, all can be Given. We needn't live and die alone...though our Enemy threatens precisely that.

Durandus I have read almost every word you have said, being that I am one of the lower echelons of civilians in the ladder the 1% has set up, most would find it astounding I can even follow what you are deeply engaging people to think about and take action to do. I am impressed and encouraged that such intellectual people are gathered here showing their desires for change, their desire to take away the corruption and power that only a small percentage of our population have acquired to pull the proverbial wool over our eyes and direct us along as good sheep. That does not mean that perhaps you couldn't take a compliment when given to you, perhaps move from behind the screen of your electronic soap box and begin to actually write organized and directed mission statements for this movement so people could begin to stand behind them as an organized body. I do not proclaim the best grammar or vocabulary but I certainly could summarize your words enough to relay it to the rest of this esteemed and organized body so they too could add to your ideas without being shot down by literary "Red Baron.
When I said you remind me of V from the movie "Vendetta" is because you clearly will not step down your words to allow people to understand you correctly but you most definitely as "V" did force your fans to rise to your creatively strong understanding of the depth of vocabulary in order to participate in any true defined literary road map with you.
So take the comment and perhaps help us, help this organization instead of quite beautifully issuing edict demands that could more productively be put in plain English in order to help this movement step out of the outer circles of societal buzz to the proverbial dinner table debates?

Just a thought...

Shade

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HELLO....new person to the site here...While I understand the magnitude of the issues raised by the occupy movement, I can honestly say in earnest that I don't think most of the population does. It is my belief that if they knew what the movement was pressing for in simple concise terms..the majority of this countries Americans would be on board....it seems to me that the occupy movement is all over the map and that being in a scattered position of protest hinders the highly significant message that could be delivered. I am not being critical--just real. Maybe the occupy leadership could hold an online election to discern 3 or 4 specific platforms from which the movement could mobilize and bombard the media with a position on these 3 or 4 selected issues of protest.

As a side note--the AARP organization has really taken a wise stance with their medicare benefits on the line by recently running ads putting politicians on notice of their strength in voting numbers--and by directing their solidarity right at the politicians running for office. Their ads say--we are 5 million strong voting Americans and we will be watching you (politicians) over the next few months and you will hear from us on election day...hence if you want to keep your job--you best be considering our desires because we are the people you represent--and we are watching.

Occupy should take this same bold in your face voting agenda. We need short concise issues that the movement feels strongly about in solidarity to target as our platform issues for resolution.

Example platforms:
1) Occupy demands an immediate criminal investigation and congressional inquiry into the reasons justifying the recent us tax dollar bail outs of financial institutions
2) Occupy demands new legislation that prohibits the --currently legal--practice of insider trading by elected officials in Congress
3) Occupy demands immediate government pressure, transparency and accountability of all banks and financial institutions that received us tax payer bail out money to disclose how the tax payer money was used to renegotiate upside down loans for Americans facing foreclosure--with renegotiation intent on Americans keeping their homes
4) 3% of the foreign aid budget redirected immediately to fund US infrastructure projects that create jobs for Americans.

These are just examples!

Next, it would be wise to bombard the media with whatever selected platforms derive so that public opinion and politicians can take sides and thus be held accountable, inspired or empowered. Lastly, the movement can be--and is--identified by the 99% population characteristic--however, we are also a remarkable voting power by our sheer numbers that if reasonably flashed in the face of politicians have the capacity to bring criminals to justice via congressional inquiry into the wall street deception and good ole boy antics. The occupy movement has this capacity! It is ripe for demanding change if simple organizational functions and leadership can focus and target. Just a thought and commentary?